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	<title>Comments on: How Bad is Our Fiscal Crisis?</title>
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	<description>Health Care Policy and Reform Insights &#124; NCPA</description>
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		<title>By: Jennie Fiedler</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68085</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennie Fiedler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jun 2010 14:43:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68085</guid>
		<description>Seeing the passing of the 28th amendment would be very encouraging,less government spending beginning with people who make careers out of being way over compensated in the first place.  And yes, less government, more self reliance and market-based solutions. Great ideas, all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seeing the passing of the 28th amendment would be very encouraging,less government spending beginning with people who make careers out of being way over compensated in the first place.  And yes, less government, more self reliance and market-based solutions. Great ideas, all.</p>
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		<title>By: John Seater</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68059</link>
		<dc:creator>John Seater</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jun 2010 02:34:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68059</guid>
		<description>John Graham:

You are right about the difference between WWII and the current fiscal mess.  As I said, the problem is control of government spending.  However, there is no need to take the federal welfare system as a given.  The war was imposed on us by the Japanese and the Germans.  In contrast, the welfare system is self-imposed, and so is its continuation.  We put it there.  We can get rid of it.  Unlike the war, all we have to do to end the welfare system is make up our minds to do so.  It will go away as fast as we want it to.  Every bit of the federal welfare system is unconstitutional, so there is no legal impediment to ending any or all of it at any pace that we find acceptable.  What the states choose to do is up to each of them to decide.

I personally favor eliminating most or all minor federal welfare programs within one year.  The big ticket items are Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security.  Medicare can be eliminated fairly quickly if the federal government opens interstate commerce to competition among health insurance companies (which it has the constitutional authority to do immediately).  Don&#039;t forget that medical care, and thus medical insurance, would cost a whole lot less if the government would butt out and let the market work.  Medicaid may need a somewhat slower phase-out.  I don&#039;t want to drop poor people abruptly on the street with no health insurance, but I do want to eliminate the program quickly.  Social Security is the hardest of all because many people have been relying on it and as a result not contributing as much to private retirement plans as they would have done in Social Security&#039;s absence.  We need a phase-out, but it has to be short or else it will be infinite.  Some hardship will be unavoidable.  Maybe people more imaginative than I can think up self-terminating ways to ease the hardship.  In any case, though, we must end the program or it will eat us alive, as it is doing now.  It is possible in principle to fix the program without eliminating it, say by restricting indexation to inflation rather than real wages, but in practice the politicians inevitably will undo any such fix to buy votes as long as the program exists.  The only permanent solution is to recognize the program&#039;s unconstitutionality and eliminate it altogether.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John Graham:</p>
<p>You are right about the difference between WWII and the current fiscal mess.  As I said, the problem is control of government spending.  However, there is no need to take the federal welfare system as a given.  The war was imposed on us by the Japanese and the Germans.  In contrast, the welfare system is self-imposed, and so is its continuation.  We put it there.  We can get rid of it.  Unlike the war, all we have to do to end the welfare system is make up our minds to do so.  It will go away as fast as we want it to.  Every bit of the federal welfare system is unconstitutional, so there is no legal impediment to ending any or all of it at any pace that we find acceptable.  What the states choose to do is up to each of them to decide.</p>
<p>I personally favor eliminating most or all minor federal welfare programs within one year.  The big ticket items are Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security.  Medicare can be eliminated fairly quickly if the federal government opens interstate commerce to competition among health insurance companies (which it has the constitutional authority to do immediately).  Don&#8217;t forget that medical care, and thus medical insurance, would cost a whole lot less if the government would butt out and let the market work.  Medicaid may need a somewhat slower phase-out.  I don&#8217;t want to drop poor people abruptly on the street with no health insurance, but I do want to eliminate the program quickly.  Social Security is the hardest of all because many people have been relying on it and as a result not contributing as much to private retirement plans as they would have done in Social Security&#8217;s absence.  We need a phase-out, but it has to be short or else it will be infinite.  Some hardship will be unavoidable.  Maybe people more imaginative than I can think up self-terminating ways to ease the hardship.  In any case, though, we must end the program or it will eat us alive, as it is doing now.  It is possible in principle to fix the program without eliminating it, say by restricting indexation to inflation rather than real wages, but in practice the politicians inevitably will undo any such fix to buy votes as long as the program exists.  The only permanent solution is to recognize the program&#8217;s unconstitutionality and eliminate it altogether.</p>
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		<title>By: John R. Graham</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68053</link>
		<dc:creator>John R. Graham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 23:50:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68053</guid>
		<description>Mr. Seater:

There is a huge difference between World War 2 and today.  The war stopped (quite suddenly) in 1945 so government spending collapsed immediately: Millions were demobbed.

There was virtually no federal welfare state to consume the money no longer used by the military (Social Security only a decade old, no Medicare or Medicaid, no Department of Education, no HUD, no FEMA, etc.) so the government simply stopped spending money that it didn&#039;t have.  As a result, the US grew out of its debt.

I think the crisis described by the other commenters might be even worse than we fear.  The European experience shows that democratic government no longer shrinks when the military shrinks.  Instead, other parts of the blob devour the budget that had belonged to the military.

Dr. Bondurant notes that President Obama looks to Sec. Gates to cut programs.  However, those dollars will go to expand Medicaid, green jobs, etc.: Not back to the people who earned them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Seater:</p>
<p>There is a huge difference between World War 2 and today.  The war stopped (quite suddenly) in 1945 so government spending collapsed immediately: Millions were demobbed.</p>
<p>There was virtually no federal welfare state to consume the money no longer used by the military (Social Security only a decade old, no Medicare or Medicaid, no Department of Education, no HUD, no FEMA, etc.) so the government simply stopped spending money that it didn&#8217;t have.  As a result, the US grew out of its debt.</p>
<p>I think the crisis described by the other commenters might be even worse than we fear.  The European experience shows that democratic government no longer shrinks when the military shrinks.  Instead, other parts of the blob devour the budget that had belonged to the military.</p>
<p>Dr. Bondurant notes that President Obama looks to Sec. Gates to cut programs.  However, those dollars will go to expand Medicaid, green jobs, etc.: Not back to the people who earned them.</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron Cohn</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68040</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Cohn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 20:15:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68040</guid>
		<description>How about reassessing the role of government?  Redefining its role to only protecting our borders from attack, protecting citizens from violent crime one upon the other.  This is about the only thing the government does well or efficiently anyway.  Is it a proper role of government to feed people, or give them free medical care, or pay for their upkeep in old age?  Our government does a lousy job at that &amp; should return responsibility for that (&amp; all the taxes it collects) to the people to use as they see fit.  Only such strong medicine can possibly get us out of our current mess and simultaneously allow a strong economy.  Who knows how to spend better, you or the federal government?

JMHO.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about reassessing the role of government?  Redefining its role to only protecting our borders from attack, protecting citizens from violent crime one upon the other.  This is about the only thing the government does well or efficiently anyway.  Is it a proper role of government to feed people, or give them free medical care, or pay for their upkeep in old age?  Our government does a lousy job at that &amp; should return responsibility for that (&amp; all the taxes it collects) to the people to use as they see fit.  Only such strong medicine can possibly get us out of our current mess and simultaneously allow a strong economy.  Who knows how to spend better, you or the federal government?</p>
<p>JMHO.</p>
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		<title>By: Don Levit</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68039</link>
		<dc:creator>Don Levit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 19:59:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68039</guid>
		<description>John Seater wrote:  &quot;They are no more an obligation than repayment of the debt.  Indeed, I would argue they are much less of an obligation.&quot;
John, you are absolutely correct.
Taxes are &quot;nonexchange transactions.&quot;  This is because taxes cannot be specifically tied to benefits, which would be private property.
Taxes are paid in for the &quot;general welfare.&quot;
The FASAB is the accounting advisor for the federal government.
In a paper entitled &quot;Accounting for Social Insurance, Revised&quot; dated Oct. 23, 2006:
page 87  A nonexchange transaction arises when one party receives value without directly giving or promising value in return.  In regards to social insurance benefits the federal government gives value to beneficiaries without receiving value in return (the government is not obligated to pay benefits, for it doesn&#039;t receive value in return).  The fact that benefits paid are not based on the amount of taxes paid confirms the nonexchange nature of social insurance.&quot;
Go to:  www.fasab.gov
Click on Exposure Drafts and Documents for Comment.
John, &quot;Sixteen Tons&quot; was the first record I ever bought.
It wasn&#039;t until rrcently that I learned the last word is &quot;store.&quot;
It sounds like &quot;stowe.&quot;
Does Ernie really snap his fingers that loud?
Don Levit</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John Seater wrote:  &#8220;They are no more an obligation than repayment of the debt.  Indeed, I would argue they are much less of an obligation.&#8221;<br />
John, you are absolutely correct.<br />
Taxes are &#8220;nonexchange transactions.&#8221;  This is because taxes cannot be specifically tied to benefits, which would be private property.<br />
Taxes are paid in for the &#8220;general welfare.&#8221;<br />
The FASAB is the accounting advisor for the federal government.<br />
In a paper entitled &#8220;Accounting for Social Insurance, Revised&#8221; dated Oct. 23, 2006:<br />
page 87  A nonexchange transaction arises when one party receives value without directly giving or promising value in return.  In regards to social insurance benefits the federal government gives value to beneficiaries without receiving value in return (the government is not obligated to pay benefits, for it doesn&#8217;t receive value in return).  The fact that benefits paid are not based on the amount of taxes paid confirms the nonexchange nature of social insurance.&#8221;<br />
Go to:  <a href="http://www.fasab.gov" rel="nofollow">http://www.fasab.gov</a><br />
Click on Exposure Drafts and Documents for Comment.<br />
John, &#8220;Sixteen Tons&#8221; was the first record I ever bought.<br />
It wasn&#8217;t until rrcently that I learned the last word is &#8220;store.&#8221;<br />
It sounds like &#8220;stowe.&#8221;<br />
Does Ernie really snap his fingers that loud?<br />
Don Levit</p>
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		<title>By: Bart Ingles</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68034</link>
		<dc:creator>Bart Ingles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 19:00:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68034</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;We must move immediately from a pay-as-you-go (unfunded) entitlement system to one which is funded and in which each generation pays its own way.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The problem is that it costs money to move from defined-benefit to defined-contribution, which means you need either a one-time increase in revenue or a one-time decrease in benefits in order to pay for the transition.  And we haven&#039;t even been able to cap the growth in defined benefits let alone reduce or eliminate them.

It seems to me that a cap in the Social Security COLA to perhaps inflation minus one percent is a logical first step.  This by itself would have the effect of encouraging growth in defined-contribution plans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>We must move immediately from a pay-as-you-go (unfunded) entitlement system to one which is funded and in which each generation pays its own way.</p></blockquote>
<p>The problem is that it costs money to move from defined-benefit to defined-contribution, which means you need either a one-time increase in revenue or a one-time decrease in benefits in order to pay for the transition.  And we haven&#8217;t even been able to cap the growth in defined benefits let alone reduce or eliminate them.</p>
<p>It seems to me that a cap in the Social Security COLA to perhaps inflation minus one percent is a logical first step.  This by itself would have the effect of encouraging growth in defined-contribution plans.</p>
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		<title>By: John Seater</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68029</link>
		<dc:creator>John Seater</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 18:38:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68029</guid>
		<description>I do not see the basis for several commenters&#039; assertions that &quot;we cannot tax our way out of this.&quot;  The federal debt at the end of World War II was larger than the GDP, and it did not take long for it to fall.  That didn&#039;t happen by magic.  Partly we raised revenue by taxation, partly the economy grew out of the debt.  If we could do it then, we can do it now.

  There is only a problem if government continues to spend the way it has been spending.  That spending level is unsustainable, but it is not inevitable.  Nothing required that the irresponsible spending programs be started, and nothing requires that they now keep going.  We can stop them any time we like.  They are no more of an obligation than repayment of the debt.  Indeed, I would argue that they are much less of an obligation.  They were put in place by a coalition of two groups: on the one hand, worthless politicians eager to buy votes and, on the other hand, worthless people eager to steal from their more productive fellow citizens.  There is no moral justification for their actions, so there also is no moral impediment to terminating their fiscally unsustainable spending programs immediately.  Termination is especially justifiable because it allows us to meet the genuine moral obligation of repaying the debt.

  Government at all levels wants to spend huge amounts of money so the politicians can buy votes.  That&#039;s what politicians do for a living, but it isn&#039;t a defensible justification for their spending.  There is no need to default on the debt or especially high taxes as long as we are willing to default on the politicians&#039; cynical promises.  Debt is a promise, and existing government spending programs are a promise.  Taken together, they happen to be incompatible with the physical reality of the lifetime budget constraint (the economic equivalent of conservation of mass).  We can&#039;t pay for both the debt and the spending at any tax rate that will not lead to outright revolt.  So which promise are we going to default on - repayment of the debt or the irresponsible political spending programs, most of which are unconstitutional anyway?  The sooner we face up to what has to be done, the easier it will be to do it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do not see the basis for several commenters&#8217; assertions that &#8220;we cannot tax our way out of this.&#8221;  The federal debt at the end of World War II was larger than the GDP, and it did not take long for it to fall.  That didn&#8217;t happen by magic.  Partly we raised revenue by taxation, partly the economy grew out of the debt.  If we could do it then, we can do it now.</p>
<p>  There is only a problem if government continues to spend the way it has been spending.  That spending level is unsustainable, but it is not inevitable.  Nothing required that the irresponsible spending programs be started, and nothing requires that they now keep going.  We can stop them any time we like.  They are no more of an obligation than repayment of the debt.  Indeed, I would argue that they are much less of an obligation.  They were put in place by a coalition of two groups: on the one hand, worthless politicians eager to buy votes and, on the other hand, worthless people eager to steal from their more productive fellow citizens.  There is no moral justification for their actions, so there also is no moral impediment to terminating their fiscally unsustainable spending programs immediately.  Termination is especially justifiable because it allows us to meet the genuine moral obligation of repaying the debt.</p>
<p>  Government at all levels wants to spend huge amounts of money so the politicians can buy votes.  That&#8217;s what politicians do for a living, but it isn&#8217;t a defensible justification for their spending.  There is no need to default on the debt or especially high taxes as long as we are willing to default on the politicians&#8217; cynical promises.  Debt is a promise, and existing government spending programs are a promise.  Taken together, they happen to be incompatible with the physical reality of the lifetime budget constraint (the economic equivalent of conservation of mass).  We can&#8217;t pay for both the debt and the spending at any tax rate that will not lead to outright revolt.  So which promise are we going to default on &#8211; repayment of the debt or the irresponsible political spending programs, most of which are unconstitutional anyway?  The sooner we face up to what has to be done, the easier it will be to do it.</p>
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		<title>By: David Lenihan</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68027</link>
		<dc:creator>David Lenihan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 18:19:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68027</guid>
		<description>Great post John.  There are many ways to tax and unfortunately my crystal ball says that the elected &quot;elite&quot; (self-proclaimed) will choose the route of least resistance, namely the dramatic devaluation of our currency via the printing press....the cruelest tax of all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post John.  There are many ways to tax and unfortunately my crystal ball says that the elected &#8220;elite&#8221; (self-proclaimed) will choose the route of least resistance, namely the dramatic devaluation of our currency via the printing press&#8230;.the cruelest tax of all.</p>
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		<title>By: Virginia</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68026</link>
		<dc:creator>Virginia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 18:11:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68026</guid>
		<description>Excellent post.  I tend to agree with Mr. Scandlen.  It&#039;s going to take some real pain for us to do anything that makes sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent post.  I tend to agree with Mr. Scandlen.  It&#8217;s going to take some real pain for us to do anything that makes sense.</p>
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		<title>By: Don Levit</title>
		<link>http://healthblog.ncpa.org/how-bad-is-our-fiscal-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-68025</link>
		<dc:creator>Don Levit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 17:53:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.john-goodman-blog.com/?p=11476#comment-68025</guid>
		<description>This is an issue in which both leftists and rightists can agree on.
Not only can we not tax our way out of this, I don&#039;t think we can grow our way out of it either (I agree with Obama on this statement).
The only way to deal with cost overruns is to just say &quot;N0, enough is enough.&quot;
A few excerpts from the 2009 Financial Report to the U.S. Government highlights the seriousness of our situation:
Page 36  -  &quot;The federal government is on an unsustaianable long-term fiscal path driven primarily by rising health care costs and known demographic trends.
Absent a change in policy, under this scenario, the interest costs on the growing debt together with spending on major entitlement programs could absorb 92 cents of every dollar of federal revenue in 2019.  Clearly, this is not sustainable.&quot;
Go to:  http://www.fms.treas.gov/fr/index.html.
Don Levit</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is an issue in which both leftists and rightists can agree on.<br />
Not only can we not tax our way out of this, I don&#8217;t think we can grow our way out of it either (I agree with Obama on this statement).<br />
The only way to deal with cost overruns is to just say &#8220;N0, enough is enough.&#8221;<br />
A few excerpts from the 2009 Financial Report to the U.S. Government highlights the seriousness of our situation:<br />
Page 36  &#8211;  &#8220;The federal government is on an unsustaianable long-term fiscal path driven primarily by rising health care costs and known demographic trends.<br />
Absent a change in policy, under this scenario, the interest costs on the growing debt together with spending on major entitlement programs could absorb 92 cents of every dollar of federal revenue in 2019.  Clearly, this is not sustainable.&#8221;<br />
Go to:  <a href="http://www.fms.treas.gov/fr/index.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.fms.treas.gov/fr/index.html</a>.<br />
Don Levit</p>
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